Pakistan Aheading To Purchase 8 Submarines From China

Pakistan‬ will procure eight ‪submarines‬ from ‪China‬ to further strengthen its defence. The National Assembly Standing Committee on Defence was informed today during its meeting in Islamabad that a contact was made with France for the supply of new sub marines which declined their supply while it has already supplied these submarines to ‪India‬. It was informed that contact was also made with countries for the purchase of these sub marines but the Chinese submarines were found more feasible to meet requirements of our Navy.

 

The Committee was also informed that the Government is also in contact with ‪France‬, ‪‎UK‬ and ‪Germany‬ to purchase used sub marines. It was also disclosed in the meeting that contacts have been made with various countries to sale JF-17 Thunder fighter plane besides other defence technology. The committee was also told that defence ties with ‪‎Russia‬ are improving gradually.

I was a rookie reporter nine years ago in October 2005 when, in the main ceremonial room of the Indian MoD, then Defence Secretary Shekhar Dutt and then Ambassador of France, the tempestuous Dominique Girard, signed the Indian government's contract for six Scorpene submarines. I had spent just over a year on the defence beat at The Indian Express. The P75 submarine build programme was one of the biggest developing stories at the time. 

 It would be the new UPA government's first defence deal, and the Indian Navy was desperate for an early conclusion. Only two weeks before the signing at the MoD, I and a small group of other reporters were huddled in a small conference room at Delhi's Hyatt Hotel receiving a briefing from Germany's HDW on the Class 214 submarine. We were only journalists, but it was a final effort to pitch the U-boat as a better product than the French offering that would defeat it less than 14 days later.

Nearly a decade later, the Germans are back in the race. Presumably. (No maker of submarines has officially declared interest in the P75I competition since it was cleared for a 'Make in India' route earlier this month.) Cleared of corruption allegations in the Shishumar-class build programme, the Germans still smart at how they lost the 2005 deal. And they'll be competing to make good. But, in every way -- every possible way -- the P75I programme is likely to be more complicated, contentious and competitive than its predecessor. The Class 214, which squared off against the Scorpene in the final race the last time, could face at least four worthy competitors this time. All come with their own technical, capability-centric and political pros and cons:

All six submarines will be built in India at an Indian shipyard. By December, the MoD has committed to identifying the public and private shipyards capable of taking on such work. Apart from Mazagon Dock Ltd (MDL) and L&T's shipyards (the only two currently engaged in submarine building work), the MoD will size up Cochin Shipyard Ltd, GRSE, GSL, Hindustan Shipyard Ltd (HSL) and Pipavav, among prospective others. 

Here's the original P75I request for information from years ago, which originally envisaged two submarines built by the OEM and four in an Indian shipyard:

REQUEST FOR INFORMATION FOR PROCUREMENT OF 06 CONVENTIONAL SUBMARINES UNDER PROJECT 75(I) 

1. INDIAN NAVY IS IN THE PROCESS OF IDENTIFYING A CONTEMPORARY CONVENTIONAL SUBMARINE FOR CONSTRUCTION AS FOLLOWS:- 

(A) TWO SUBMARINES AT COLLABORATORS SHIPYARD. 

(B) FOUR SUBMARINES AT TWO INDIAN SHIPYARDS. 

2. INDIAN NAVY REQUESTS INFORMATION FROM FIRMS WHO HAVE INDEPENDENTLY DESIGNED AND CONSTRUCTED A COMPLETE MODERN CONVENTIONAL SUBMARINE WHICH IS CURRENTLY IN SERVICE / UNDERGOING SEA TRIALS. THE SUBMARINE SHOULD BE CAPABLE OF OPERATING IN OPEN OCEAN AND LITTORAL / SHALLOW WATERS IN DENSE ASW AND EW ENVIRONMENT AND ABLE TO UNDERTAKE FOLLOWING MISSIONS:-

(A) ANTI SURFACE AND ANTI SUBMARINE WARFARE.
(B) SUPPORTING OPERATIONS ASHORE.
(C) ISR MISSIONS.
(D) SPECIAL FORCE AND MINING OPS.

3. PROSPECTIVE COLLABORATORS ARE REQUESTED TO FORWARD DATA REGARDING THE FOLLOWING CAPABILITIES OF THE PROPOSED DESIGN:- 

(A) MAXIMUM DIVING DEPTH WITHOUT LIMITATION ON NUMBER OF DIVES. 

(B) MAXIMUM OPERATING RANGE (DIVED-SNORT-SURFACE) AND MISSION ENDURANCE. 

(C) AIR INDEPENDENT PROPULSION SYSTEM BEING OFFERED. 

(D) SURFACE DISPLACEMENT AND RESERVE BUOYANCY. 

(E) INDISCRETION RATE.

(F) SEA WATER SPECIFIC GRAVITY OPERATING RANGE. 

(G) TORPEDO TUBES WITH CAPABILITY TO LAUNCH LONG RANGE HEAVY WEIGHT WIRE GUIDED TORPEDOES, MISSILES AND METHOD FOR WEAPON DISCHARGE. 

(H) EXTERNALLY LAUNCHED TORPEDO DECOY SYSTEM. 

(J) INTEGRATED COMBAT SYSTEM (DETAILS OF PROSPECTIVE SUPPLIERS TO BE PROVIDED). 

(K) CONTEMPORARY LOW NOISE PROPULSION AND POWER GENERATION SYSTEM. 

(L) AUXILIARY MOTORS WITH TAKE HOME CAPABILITY. 

(M) CONTEMPORARY IPMS, SMCS, APMS. 

(N) AC SYSTEM CUSTOMISED FOR OPERATION IN TROPICAL WATERS CHARACTERISED BY HIGH TEMPERATURE AND HIGH HUMIDITY CONDITIONS. 

4. THE FOLLOWING DATA IN RESPECT OF THE PROPOSED SUBMARINE BE PROVIDED ALONG WITH RESPONSE TO RFI:- 

(A) RADIATED NOISE LEVELS IN FREQUENCY BAND 30 Hz TO 10000Hz (db // REF μPa) AT SPEED OF 5 KNOTS AND 10 KN 

(B) NOISE AND VIBRATION DATA FOR MAJOR PROPULSION AND AUXILIARY MACHINERY (C) MANOEUVRABILITY & STABILITY CHARACTERISTICS 

5. THE RESPONSE TO THIS RFI SHOULD ALSO ELABORATE THE FOLLOWING:-

(A) SCOPE AND DEPTH FOR TRANSFER OF TECHNOLOGY (TOT) FOR SUBMARINE DESIGN & CONSTRUCTION AND PRODUCTION OF KEY SYSTEMS/SUBSYSTEMS AT INDIAN SHIPYARD / BY INDIAN INDUSTRY.
(B) PLAN FOR DISCHARGE OF OFFSET COMMITMENTS AS ENUMERATED IN THE "DEFENCE PROCUREMENT PROCEDURE – 2008" AT WEBSITE WWW.MOD.NIC.IN. 

(C) FEASIBILITY AND PROPOSED APPROACH FOR USE OF ITEMS / EQUIPMENTS SOURCED FROM INDIAN INDUSTRY ON THE SUBMARINE. 

(D) PLAN FOR TRAINING SHIPYARD PERSONNEL FOR PROJECT IMPLEMENTATION AND INDIAN NAVY PERSONNEL IN ASPECTS OF SUBMARINE DESIGN. 

6. IT IS REQUESTED THAT THE RESPONSE TO THIS RFI BE FORWARDED BY 30 SEP 10.

Source: Livefist

Existing World Submarine Classes_Mostly Popular

Yuan class:

Operators: People's Liberation Army Navy Pakistan Navy

Preceded by: Type 039 (Song class)
Succeeded by: New next-generation SSG (under development)

Completed: 7

General characteristics
Length: 75 m
Propulsion: Diesel-electric, 1 shaft, AIP (air-independent propulsion)
Speed: 20+ kts
Armament: 6 torpedo tubes

The Type 041 is also believed to be capable of launching YJ-8X (C-80X) series anti-ship missiles.
The Type 041 is also capable of firing the CY-1 ASW missile under water, but the status of the missile is in question because nothing is heard about its production.
On July 20th, 2011 it was made public that Pakistan signed a contract for 6 submarines.

Scorpène class:

Class overview
Name: Scorpène
Builders: DCNS Navantia nMazagon Dock Limited Brazilian Navy Shipyard
Operators: Chilean Navy Indian Navy Royal Malaysian Navy Brazilian Navy
Preceded by: Agosta-class submarine
Succeeded by: Marlin-class submarine
Subclasses: CA-2000 CM-2000 AM-2000 S-BR
Cost: $450 million
Building: 2
Planned: 19
Completed: 4
Cancelled: 4
Active: 4
General characteristics
Type: submarine
Displacement: 1,565 tons (CM-2000) 1,870 tons (AM-2000) 2,000 tons (S-BR)[1]
Length: 61.7m (CM-2000) 70m (AM-2000) 75m (S-BR)[1]
Beam: 6.2 m
Draft: 5.8 m
Propulsion: Diesel-Electric, Batteries, and AIP
Speed: 20 knots (37 km/h) (submerged) 12 kn (22 km/h) (surfaced)
Range: 6,500 nautical miles (12,000 km) at 8 knots (surfaced) 550 nmi (1,020 km) at 5 knots (submerged)
Endurance: 40 days (compact) n50 days (normal) 50+21 days (AIP)
Test depth: >300 meters
Complement: 31
Armament: 6 x 533-mm torpedo tubes for 18 Whitehead Alenia Sistemi Subacquei
Black Shark heavyweigh torpedoes or SM.39 Exocet anti-ship missiles, 30 mines in place of torpedoes.

Kilo class Project 636 units: 

Displacement:
2,300–2,350 tons surfaced
3,000–4,000 tons submerged
Dimensions:
Length: 70–74 meters
Beam: 9.9 meters
Draft: 6.2–6.5 meters
Maximum speed
10–12 knots surfaced
17–25 knots submerged
Propulsion: Diesel-electric 5,900 shp (4,400 kW)
Maximum depth: 300 meters (240–250 meters operational)
Endurance
400 nautical miles (700 km) at 3 knots (6 km/h) submerged
6,000 nautical miles (11,000 km) at 7 knots (13 km/h) snorkeling (7,500 miles for the Improved Kilo class)
45 days sea endurance
Armament
Air defence: 8 SA-N-8 Gremlin or SA-N-10 Gimlet[26] Surface-to-air missiles (export submarines may not be equipped with air defense weapons)
Six 533 mm torpedo tubes with 18 53-65 ASuW or TEST 71/76 ASW torpedoes or VA-111 Shkval supercavitating "underwater missiles", or 24 DM-1 mines,
Club S anti-ship missiles (only on some export versions)
Crew: 52
Price per unit is US$200–250 million (China paid approx. US$1.5-2 billion for 8 Project 636 Kilo class submarines).

Type 209 submarine:

General characteristics
Type: Type 209/1500 submarine
Displacement: 1,810 t, submerged
Length: 64.4 m
Beam: 6.5 m
Draft: 6.2 m
Propulsion: Diesel-electric, 4 diesels, 1 shaft, 6100 shp
Speed: 11.5 knots (21 km/h), surfaced;
22.5 knots (42 km/h), submerged
Range: 11,000 nmi. at 10 knots, surfaced,
(20,000 km at 20 km/h);
8,000 nmi. at 10 knots, snorkeling,
(15,000 km at 20 km/h);
400 nmi. at 4 knots, submerged
(740 km at 7 km/h)
Test depth: 500 m
Complement: 36
Armament: 8 x 21-inch (533 mm) torpedo tubes,
14 torpedoes; optional UGM-84 Harpoon integration.

Type 214 submarine:

 

 General characteristics
Displacement: 1,690 t (surfaced), 1,860 t (submerged)
Length: 213 feet 3 inches (65.0 m)
Beam: 20 feet 8 inches (6.3 m)
Draught: 19 feet 8 inches (6.0 m)
Propulsion: Diesel-electric, fuel cell AIP, low noise skew back propeller
Speed: 12 kt surfaced
20 kt submerged
Range: 12,000 miles (19,300 km) surfaced
420 nmi (780 km) @ 8 kt
1,248 nmi (2,311 km) @ 4 kt
Endurance: 84 days
Test depth: 250m (400m theoretical)
Complement: 5 officers + 22 crew
Armament: (8) 533 mm torpedo tubes, (4) subharpoon-capabl.

 

Choosing French Submarines over German?

 

A German team is due in few days probably on August 5th according to sources to look into possibility of signing the accord for provision of U-214 submarines to Pakistan Navy.
However reports appearing in the media suggest that the deal may hit snags due to change of mind in the current Pakistani government over purchase of German submarines.

In 2008 Pakistan Navy under chief of navel staff Admiral Muhammad Afzal Tahir made efforts for including German 214 Class submarines in its fleet and owing to Navy’s persistent efforts, the government had approved plans for acquisition of these submarines to be built at Karachi Shipyard under transfer of technology programme.

The details were later worked out between the two countries when a Pakistan Navy delegation visited Germany in April.

However recently quoting Pakistani government sources, the Financial Times Deutschland says President Asif Zardari may overrule his military’s preference for the German subs to take up a “better offer” from France.

But what better submarines France can offer to Pakistan? That is a question to ponder because France has no better submarines to offer Pakistan at the moment whereas French are indeed not ready to offer us nuclear submarine.

What France has in store? :

There are three options 1. Scorpion, 2. Marlin and 3. Barracuda submarines. But again the Scorpions are not superior to U 214, neither these will be having any benefit for Pakistan because French company DCN is already going to provide Scorpion to Indian Navy ahead of Pakistan.

U-214 is way better than French design given to India. Marlin is just on drawing board and will take forever to go to prototype stage and then test and evaluation and finally induction into Pakistan Navy meanwhile India will have all its Scorpion in sea. DCN (Direction des Constructions Navales ), France will not be able to fulfill Pakistani order ahead of Indians. The success of Marlin, or weather or not it will be better than U-214 German sub cannot be predicted. Currently, U-214 for the best non-nuclear submarine in the world, and our friends in Turkey will soon produce it at home with the license of production.

Now the only option for Pakistan will be to ask for Barracuda submarine but it is unlikely that France will sell us nuclear submarine. Barracuda is a nuclear powered submarine and France does not currently allow the sale of nuclear-propelled submarines.

Despite having French Agosta-90B submarines, the Pakistani Navy opted for purchasing German Torpedoes for fitting to Agosta-90B due to the superior German technology.
Pakistan Navy needs German submarines because the German U-214 subs are far better than the French Scorpion.

If the current government goes for inferior quality French submarines then it will indeed give weight to suspicion of many Pakistanis who see bribes as main factor behind any irrational decisions viz viz defence deals.

Already the Pakistani senators have demanded in an incamera briefing from Pakistani Naval chief in the Senate.

Whereas some eyebrows have also been raised over the fact that foreign secretary Salman Bashir in the current government of Zardari is the brother of Naval Chief, Noman Bashir and there are also some reports that PIA chairman is going to be named Pakistani envoy to France. Some political pundits see such an appointment an attempt to muster a deal for French submarines.

On the other hand submarine acquisition project (SMAP) a group composed of Naval officers who have recommended U-214 submarines over other options after extensive study has been disbanded and the officers have been posted out at different stations.

Though earlier the Germans have delayed the deal due to political situation of Pakistan but can kickoff cutting of hull for first submarine immediately after signing the deal.

In such a situation going for something which does not fulfill the requirement of Pakistan Navy would be tantamount to putting the national defence at risk.

There is no reason not to go for German submarines specially when Berlin even granted federal export credit guarantees worth nearly $1.4 billion for the purchase of the same.